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Workbook Radio Episode 19 – Daniel Bedell with Tropico Photo, Part 1

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Workbook Radio is proud to present another interview series by photographer/podcaster Daniel Bedell. In this next series, Daniel talks with married duo Michelle Norris and Forrest Aguire, who make up Tropico Photo. In this episode, Daniel, Michelle, and Forrest discuss what it’s like working with a partner and/or significant other.

 

MN: “…and honestly, merging Tropico Photo was the best thing we ever did because that was 2 years ago.  From the time that we created a name, created all of our branding, our website and everything, at that point we just had five or six personal projects on our website. We have been busy for two years. It’s like we put it out into the universe and just started getting work. And it felt like it was a real thing then. But working with your romantic partner is a whole different thing.” (Laughing)

FA: “Yeah I was going to say in commercial photography, like doing support roles and seeing how a commercial shoot runs, also I think really helped us to allot different tasks on set  and before and after to kind of separate and apply our different skill sets, so that there’s some overlap, but we’re really able to be incredibly efficient on a shoot and through our business. So I felt like that was another reason that joining together appealed to us: we were kind of able to specialize within our company, and that’s really worked well for us.”

DB: “Was it difficult or scary at all to start this brand new entity and make it feel like, hey we have some reputation and stuff built behind our own individual names, and now we’re sort of starting from scratch with this new entity?”

MN: “Yeah. I think that there was some of that, of it being scary, because we definitely held on to our personal photography entities for a time after we created Tropico. And where we would sometimes do work by ourselves and we still had our personal website[s] and I feel like that was kind of clinging to this comfort of ‘well you can still be an autonomous being if you want.’ But I think probably 6 months after when we had been getting a lot of work together, and we were sort of ironing out all the little bumps of working together, we just decided to get rid of our personal websites. I think there was one project I did by myself. I kind of came away just feeling like I didn’t love the outcome as much as when Forest and I work together, and I was like, you know I’m so much happier with the work that we make as a pair. I feel so elevated that I just don’t want to be making anything outside [Tropico].”

FA: “That was a consistent thing I think both of us kept saying, was the work we make together was just better than work we can make on our own.”

MN: “Yeah.”

FA:” And it kind of became a mantra to the point where we were like, what are we doing?”

MN: “Why are we like holding on to our weird personal websites when we don’t even want people to hire us for them?”

FA: “I also think being a relationship complicated it. At least for me there was a decent amount of anxiety about going into business together and the kind of stress it would put on us romantically. And there was a while where I felt like I was resisting. But in the end I feel like, even though it is very challenging, it is also very satisfying, and the work that we are able to make together and what it brings to our relationship I think reinforces our closeness on a romantic level as well.”

DB: “What do you see as from a business standpoint, or from a creation and production standpoint, the benefits of being a duo?”

MN: “I think the biggest thing is a little bit of what Forest was talking about with our ability to specialize inside of our business. Because, you know, with the type of advertising and editorial work we’re doing there is a lot of concepting that’s important, but also stylistically have sort of our own brand on just the way that the photography looks, but like the way that the styling would read, the way that the sets look, the way that the lighting looks, and all these things that realistically, when you hire out contractors for all those different things, it kind of makes it harder to keep this consistency through the work that builds a world we’re personally excited about every part of.

“I think that we are able to have so much control over each part in a way so that each of us can focus on these parts and so we end up being more, I wouldn’t say a production team, but like leaning more production team than just photographer, which I think helps us to put more of a mark on everything that we make.”

FA: “And I would say that on all on smaller budget or tighter projects we are actually able to offer entire production, which can be really nice like if a client wants, has a really dialed in concept, but they need us to travel and they only have so much money, because we don’t have to externalize any of those costs; we can make it work for them sometimes…where I feel like if it’s just one photographer and they need more help it just wouldn’t be realistic.”

MN: “I also feel like working as a team, like all the parts of business, it’s easier to split those up. Because at this point, we don’t have an assistant or anything, even though we talk about doing that. But being able to minimize stress by knowing what your roles are in running the business on a day-to-day [basis] and having someone that you trust just as much doing other parts of it definitely helps to run smoother.”

FA: “And one thing we keep talking about on set is just how important it is to have somebody who can give you immediate affirmation and confirmation when you have a shot. I feel like we hear time and time again clients are really happy with our work on set and to see us in action because they’re like,: ‘You know what you want, and you know when you got it.’ They talk about how they’ve had different experiences with different photographers who are turning to the client for approval or their team to be like, ‘Is this good?’ and I feel like we’re able to just look at each other and be like: ‘This is good. We’ve got it. Let’s move on.’ It makes for a very efficient and confident partnership.”

DB:” What are, for other photographers who might be thinking, ‘What if I joined up with someone else?’ And sometimes maybe that is romantic, sometimes maybe they’re just, it’d be nice to have a partner. What are some of the things you think are difficult or hard to navigate that they should be aware of?”

MN: “I think for me the biggest thing is (we’ve run into this like a little more recently, but now that we have been so busy for a long time) having a challenging vetting process, deciding what jobs to take. Because you’re not just choosing to take a job by yourself, so there’s this process of: do we agree we both want this job, and we think, you know, the budget’s lower, but it has other qualities  worth it and are going to lead to something else in the future. But it can be difficult to realize you can’t take a job alone, so you both need to feel confident this is something that is going to be good for your career and good for your work.

“The other thing I feel is it makes it almost harder to take breaks sometimes, working with another person. We’ve been trying to sort this out, but it makes you not want to feel like you’re not doing as much as the other person, so it becomes this sort of thing of unless you’re making sure you’re working at the exact same time all the time, then it makes it feel like you constantly want to be doing something for the business…like constantly figuring out what you could be doing to be more productive or help move a project along.

“I think if you are working on your own, it would be a little bit easier to decide, like you are independently choosing to take a break or some time off without guilt that comes about worrying the other person is feeling they have to do more than you at that time.”

DB: “So your big challenge is because you’re two competitive people combining, it’s hard to find time to be lazy?

MN: (laughing) “Yeah, like how do we not?!”

FA: (laughing)” And it’s definitely self-inflicted. The other person might say, ‘No, no, no, you don’t have anything to work on; let me knock this out.’ But it doesn’t matter because internally you still feel guilty, and you kind of self-impose this competition.”

 

You can check out the full episode below.

Check out Tropico Photo on Workbook.com.

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