A fascinating start of a conversation as podcaster and lifestyle photographer, Daniel Bedell strikes up a conversation with editorial illustrator James Yang. In this first episode, Daniel and James discuss beginnings, switching from painting to digital, and finding business sense and voice in the illustration world.
DB: “You know one of the first things I was interested in with an illustrator is: how did you in the beginning figure out the business side of things and business direction? [Because] In photography a lot of people assist other photographers and learn from older photographers. Does illustration have an equivalent of that?”
JY: “For me, yes. I was lucky because my first year I worked freelance as a production person for a one-man studio. So, that was perfect to see how a studio should be run for a one-person perspective. I got to see how to talk to clients; how do you carry yourself on the phone, something as simple as that. And I got to see their marketing, so I learned a lot about how to mail. Back then, this is pre-internet, that’s how old I am, how to do mailings, and how to even put together a portfolio. And then even I helped an older illustrator […], who was one of my heroes because I started in Washington, DC, and he showed me a lot of the ropes. So, we do have an equivalent in marketing, things like that. I learned a lot from those two for sure.”
DB: “Do you still have people, young people, coming out of school do that role for you? That they work for you? Is that still how you suggest people learn?”
JY: “You know what? I don’t because since I work on the computer. I used to have assistants but not anymore. But there are some illustrators who do have assistants, and I would definitely recommend that. And the other way, especially in New York, there are a lot of other illustrators who have no problem meeting younger illustrators. I’m even sort of mentoring a lot of the younger illustrators. When I mean young I’m talking even into their ’30s or whatever, but we’ve known each other forever.”
DB: “I’ve heard you talk a little bit in some interviews I saw online about making the switch from painting, and probably drawing too, to doing things digitally. It seemed like you really embraced that.”
JY: “Sure.”
DB: “I was wondering with when you made that switch; did it change the tone and style of your work at all, or was it really an important thing for you not to change the stye of your work?”
JY: “It definitely changed the style and tone of my work, and it was a scary change because I was rolling pretty well with my painting technique, which was textural and painterly. But I also had a different philosophical point of view that digital was sort of its own medium. You know what I mean? So I wanted to take advantage of the things Photoshop, I mainly work in Photoshop, could offer. And I tried to take advantage of that and just create my work organically because of the technology. And I’m not going to lie, it took a couple years for clients to get used to it because some of them did like my older stuff. But also there was an evolution where my newer stuff, even though it was different, it caught a lot of the same energy that my older stuff had. And now what’s nice, is a lot of my clients even used me when I was doing more painting; they told me what’s nice about my work is it’s evolved: they feel like it’s me but fresher. It seems current, so yay! (laughing) Happy!”
DB: “Why kind of abandon the panting? So one of the other illustrators I talked to was Greg Manchess-”
JY: “Sure.”
DB: “And I get the impression that he kind of has done both. He has some stuff that is very much painterly, and he even finds that as more people have abandoned painting maybe there’s less competition. He maybe stands out more. So why not incorporate both? Why kind of be more singular in your direction?”
JY: “Well you know Greg’s a good friend of mine, so maybe if I painted like him I would do that too.”
(laughing)
DB: “He does seem pretty good at it.”
JY: “You know what, if I only could switch my hands for his, how happy I would be. (laughing) But no, for me at the time I remember, ironically, I felt a creative ceiling with painting. I felt like I couldn’t go, there wasn’t anywhere else for me to go. And part of it was my personality too, where I did not like the planning part of painting. There’s a lot of planning of how you paint the backgrounds, what sequence you work in, because I change my mind a lot. And you know, sometimes the painting, once you set a path, you’re just stuck on it and you must make that work. I like the flexibility of digital work…how you can change your mind, have different layers and versions.
“So that’s why I really made the switch; it was ironically a creative decision. [Why I made the switch.] But now the iPad Pro or Wacoms are ironically even bringing in a little bit of the painting stuff from back then to my digital work now. So it’s kind of a full circle process. Like I did a series for Golf Digest when they sent me to the Masters, and there are a lot of painterly elements in there that I haven’t done in years. It was sort of nice to revisit those elements.”
DB: “You know one thing, when I look at your work, you have a really distinct style that really goes through all of your work. I was curious, obviously I see the positive side of that; a lot of photographers try to have a distinct style, and you become known for something, and people really seek you out as that specialist, but I wonder if it ever gets boring or you ever feel a little trapped. One thing I was thinking of, and I may just be totally wrong here, I could see it may be difficult to do political illustration in your style, and maybe there are times when you want to do that or something like that. I was just wondering if there’s ever a downside to having a very distinct look?”
JY: “Well you know, ironically I started out my career as a political artist. I did a lot of op-ed stuff for the Washington Post. Even this year I’m doing a lot more op-ed stuff for the New York Times again, so I’m actually doing a lot of political stuff these days, and it kind of echoes my earlier style. I’m sort of lucky this way. No matter which direction I go, it always looks like my work. Do you know what I mean?
“And I am a pretty evolutionary artist. I go through these gradual changes or phases. And I even sometimes do hit that ceiling you’re talking about, and I think of it as rebooting. Almost like, you know what? Let’s pretend we have different universes because that’s a big thing on TV and movies these days and all these alternate universes, right? I’ll say, alright let’s backtrack and imagine our career in a more design-y direction…you know, more Paul Rand? And then you’ll see that influence. And that will be how my work will evolve. And then maybe some other time I’ll reboot again. Let me imagine that I’m trying in this direction…
“So I feel like my work is more versatile than most people think. And honestly like I said in my interviews, I draw the way I draw because no matter what I do it just sort of turns out like how I do things. I don’t know if that’s a limitation of me or it’s just my voice. I guess for marketing purposes I should call it my voice, right? (laughing) Yeah, it’s my voice!”
DB: “Yeah, the positive spin. That’s good.”
JY:”Well actually, one of my friends, Henrik Drescher, said something brilliant, which is, it feels like most creatives (he’s a wonderful illustrator who’s an influence of mine). But he makes a point that he feels all creatives sort of have either one or two architectural structures inside their heads, and that’s how they see the world. I’m sure that makes sense. And as I get older, I kind of think that’s a pretty brilliant observation on his part.”
Listen to the full episode below!
To see more of James Yang’s work, click here.
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